Difference between revisions of "Template talk:StoryArc Blind Faith"

Revision as of 21:33, 19 March 2012

Naming Convention

So, is it Template:StoryArc or Template: Story Arc? I have seen it used both ways. —Thirty7 11:34, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

I just used the most recent example I could find, but a search indicates that Template:StoryArc has the vast majority of uses, including documentation. It appears that Template:Story Arc is used (maybe mistakenly) for just a handful of articles, though I'm not sure that even all the instances of Template:StoryArc are consistent within each article. -- Blondeshell 13:06, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't even know why you're using a template. You can put the mission articles in the contact article without an intermediary step (see Heather Townshend).

Also, according to the discussion on the forums, Theoden's missions should be "Blind Faith (Theoden) - Part One: blahblah". ~ AGGE talk/cons 18:10, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

I was basing the article format on what we'd done for other SSA contacts, and used Agent Kwahu's updated format as a guide. Though even it doesn't use the "Story Arc (Contact)" format, so I'm not sure which is correct. While the Theoden and Alastor arcs tell two different sides of the same story, the missions don't have the same names, and they're different enough that they shouldn't have to have the contact names included. -- Blondeshell 18:47, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

According to Paragon Wiki:Mission articles, the guidelines we've written up for the mission namespace, it should be "Story Arc Name - Mission Name". Since both Theoden and Alastor's story arcs are named Blind Faith, the decision was made to put their name in parentheses after the story arc name. Theoden/Alastor are special cases, since their story arcs are named the same but have different contents (versus story arcs that are the exact same arc given by multiple contacts). ~ AGGE talk/cons 01:52, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

I might be missing something, but the name of Alastor's arc in his article is "One Life, One Goal." -- Blondeshell 02:22, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Wow. So it is. I have no idea how I missed that (repeatedly). Yes. So Theoden's missions should be "Blind Faith - Part One: Blahblah". ~ AGGE talk/cons 03:03, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

So after poking around a bit, I think I've cleaned up all the incorrectly named story arcs in missionspace. (Not many mistakes thankfully.) Additionally, I found the arc that I was thinking of when I made my initial comment (Borea/Leo Poggiani), whose arcs are both named "The Fate of All Men" (and thus require a contact name flag on them in missionspace). Also additionally as well, I still have no idea why we're using an intermediary template when it all could easily be placed on the contact page directly, which is what both Sekoia and I have been doing. ~ AGGE talk/cons 06:50, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Dunno. It does seem a little unnecessary for that extra step. Was there some discussion where we decided we needed it? -- Blondeshell 16:32, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Specifically in answer to the intermediary template: Yes, it can be done the way you've been doing it - without the intermediary template. However, doing so represents a shift in convention from the way it's been handled in the past (with good logic for doing it that way at the time). I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong, but it seems like if we had planned to make that shift going forward, maybe that could have been discussed when we first introduced the Mission namespace. For now, I'm going to hold off on doing any more updates to the existing contacts until we sort this out so that I don't aggravate any issues here. --Eabrace 16:38, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

So I did a little looking, and I am confused. There are maybe only... 15? Story Arcs on the entire Wiki that use the Template:StoryArc or Story Arc format. And to top it off, {{StoryArc}} has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with creating a page for entire Story Arcs, merely something that was intended to be used as some kind of header for them. I have been specifically avoiding adding Story Arcs to the Wiki for just this reason: I am unsure of proper formatting and from which existing Arcs to copy, because they don't seem very consistent in terms of dialogue formatting, etc. What's the "right" way? —Thirty7 22:33, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

1) The StoryArc templates originally came about in order to handle the cases where you have multiple contacts that offer the same story arc. For example, the Vahzilok Plague is offered by Olivia Chung, Dr. Ann-Marie Engles, Juliana Nehring, and Pavel Garnier. Using a template for the entire arc makes it easier to update the arc for all four contacts without having to update each page individually. Also note that these templates pre-date creation of the Mission namespace and the individual mission articles.

2) When I started working through the old contacts to move the missions to individual pages, I noticed the discrepancy between StoryArc and Story Arc in the arc templates. Counting the use of each, I decided to stick with the predominant StoryArc and have been renaming the Story Arc templates as I encounter them in the course of working through the contacts.

3) I've also been trying to standardize the contents of the StoryArc templates. Some included the merits, some did not. Some included the associated souvenir, some did not. And some that did include the souvenir included it as text instead of using the Souvenir template to grab the text from the souvenir's article (the biggest mess that immediately comes to mind is the one I had to straighten out for the Letter from Requiem.) As I've been going through the contacts, I've been standardizing as follows:

• convert all missions to individual mission pages
• consolidate all story arcs into StoryArc templates and replace story arc missions on contact pages with the StoryArc template
• place merit information at the top of the StoryArc template
• place souvenir information between merit info and missions in the StoryArc template using the Souvenir template
  • if the souvenir's individual page does not already exist, create it
• place individual missions in the StoryArc template
• tag the StoryArc template with the Story Arc Templates category so that all story arcs eventually appear in that category.

If you're wondering which contacts with story arcs I've updated so far:

• Agent G
• Agent Kwahu
• Agent Wallace
• Allison King
• Amanda Loomis
• Andrea Mitchell
• Andrew Fiore
• Angus McQueen
• Anton Sampson
• Ashwin Lannister
• Athena Currie
• Barry Gosford
• Buck Salinger
• Cain Royce
• Carla Brunelli
• Collin Larson
• Crimson
• Eliza Thorpe
• Everett Daniels
• Jenny Firkins
• Jill Pastor
• John Strobel
• Jose Escalante
• Justin Greene
• Kong Bao
• Kyle Peck
• Laura Brunetti
• Lorenzo Tate
• Lou Pasterelli
• Marvin Weintraub
• Merisel Valenzuela
• Miriam Bloechl
• Neal Kendrick
• Oswald Cuthbert
• Rondel Jackson
• Thao Ku
• Tina Chung
• Tristan Caine
• Virginia Hoffman
• Vitaly Cherenko
• Wilson Eziquerra

--Eabrace 01:20, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't think we ever had any discussions about "Template:Story Arc" type articles in the past. As Eabrace notes, they were originally used when multiple contacts offered the same arc. In that context, they make sense because we don't want to repeat information. I see absolutely no need to make "Template:Story Arc" articles for new story arcs when they have only one contact, and that clearly wasn't the intent historically because if it were we'd have tons more story arc templates. They were making those articles solely to avoid duplication, not because story arcs were supposed to get their own templates. Creating new separate articles for each Story Arc could be worthwhile, but I really think that putting those articles in Template space doesn't make sense. Template isn't a content namespace and its contents won't be hit by searches. I would posit that if we want to have dedicated articles for each story arc that is independent of its contact(s), then we should do so in the main namespace (with article names such as "One Life, One Goal") or we should create a Story Arc namespace for them (with article names such as "Story Arc:One Life, One Goal". If we want a "Story Arc:" namespace, I can easily set that up and make it searchable by default just like "Mission:". (As an aside, keep in mind that task forces and strike forces are also technically story arcs and would have their content handled in the same way.) Personally: at the moment I have no opinion on whether we should create separate articles for story arcs; if we do create separate articles then I lean mildly towards using a separate namespace; and if we don't, then I'm completely against using the Template namespace except in cases where multiple contacts share an arc. -- Sekoia 17:48, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

On this, As Sekoia says, there has been no recent discussion about the Story Arc template (as in, within more than a year.). Frankly I wasn't really aware of it until now! As with Agge and Sekoia, I've been placing arcs in mission namesppace articles directly on the page, with the an addition to the name convention where the name of the arc is the same, the contacts are different and the content is different (such as the SSA).

I do have an opinion on using Story Arc templates at all times: I'm averse to using Story Arc templates unless there's a real need, and that should be only when when the story arc is available from more than one source and has the same content.

I'm with Sekoia here too: the Template namespace must not be used for story arc content.

Just my thoughts on this. Taosin 21:33, 19 March 2012 (UTC)